Wednesday 22 August 2012

Ehrperson on Unbelievable?

Another Facebook thread repost, this one about Bart Ehrman's recent discussion with Justin Brierley on Unbelievable? regarding "Jesus mythicism".

  • So...Ehrperson on Unbelievable. Thoughts?
    · · · Monday at 00:06

    • Paul Jenkins Very easy for Ehrman to say Price is wrong when he's not there to back up his statements. I know it was only a small part of the show but Justin lets this happen too often IMHO.

      I thought Ehrman skated round Carrier's criticisms without answering them, preferring to moan about the latter's caustic reviewing style. Anyone who's heard Carrier deliver a talk will know that his style is generally mocking and snarky. Complaining that he's "unscholarly" is really evading the issues.

    • Paul Baird Didn't listen to it. My focus is more on the social impact of Christianity. Aside from the nativity I'm not terribly interested in whether or not Jesus the man existed. The nativity itself is just so wacko and borrows from so many other myths and fables that I do like asking Christians to answer questions about it - to make them think.

    • Paul Jenkins ‎"The nativity itself is just so wacko and borrows from so many other myths and fables..."

      Which was one of the points Ehrman attempts to refute.

    • Paul Baird I think once someone comes up with a source for the conversations between the Three Wise Men and Herod or The Shepherds and the Angels then I might take notice.

    • Paul Jenkins But it's in the Bible! (Oops, sorry, already done that bit....)

    • Paul Baird and what was He doing between birth, age 12 and age 30 ?

      The Long Running Ancient Levant version of Big Brother ?

    • Paul Baird ‎"It's day 5687, Mary has two nominations, Joseph six and Jesus four. Who will be voted out ? You decide !"

    • Paul Jenkins In the latest (I think) "The Human Bible" Robert Price comments on whether theologians believe the baby Jesus was divinely perfect. I remember reading some commentary about whether the teenage Jesus had "impure thoughts".

      Not exactly world-shattering.

    • Fergus Gallagher Just listening to

      "David Fitzgerald, author of “Nailed: Ten Christian Myths That Show Jesus Never Existed at All,” joined us today to talk about Jesus mythicism. If Jesus was so important and performed so many miracles during his lifetime, why was nothing written about him by those who knew him? Could it be that Jesus was just a myth? "

      (It's in the 2nd part, sep. mp3)
      Episode #204 – David Fitzgerald Welcome back to Strange Frequencies Radio!  Can ...See more
      Monday at 19:01 · ·

    • Paul Baird I can believe that after reading some of Glenn Peoples guff.

      So many Phds in search of so much irrelevance.

    • Helen Marple-Horvat are you guys all mythicists? Thats crazy if true...I will have to clear off. lol

    • Paul Baird Helen Marple-Horvat - in terms of the Nativity - yes. Unless you have a source for the two conversations that I mentioned, and maybe some idea of what Jesus was up to for 30 years before he began his ministry.

      Basing his divinity on 1/11th of his life does not not appear to be sustainable.

    • Paul Jenkins Personally I think it's more likely than not a person or persons by the name of Jesus lived around that time and did things that caught people's attention. So I'm not a mythicist. However, I'm highly suspicious of the Gospel accounts, and of the fact that a large portion of the NT was written by one man with a specific agenda.

    • Fergus Gallagher I put it like this: the central relevant detail about Jesus is whether he rose from the dead ("Jesus-Christ") or not ("Jesus-not-Christ").

      I don't think Jesus-Christ existed and who really cares that much about Jesus-not-Christ?

    • Paul Jenkins Fergus, that's a fair point, but mythicists seem to be saying that Jesus-not-Christ didn't exist either. The existence of Jesus-not-Christ, however, seems to be relevant to whether Jesus-Christ existed (as far as believers are concerned).

      I'd probably go as far as saying Jesus was a legendary character, but not an out-and-out myth. I think the stories are probably based on some facts. I don't think the character of Jesus was totally made up. It's been suggested he was a composite, which seems likely to me.

    • Fergus Gallagher ‎"The existence of Jesus-not-Christ, however, seems to be relevant to whether Jesus-Christ existed (as far as believers are concerned)."

      No - they are distinct and incompatible in this formulation.

    • Fergus Gallagher The other way I like to put it is that I think a Jesus existed in a similar way to the way Robin Hood existed - whatever grains of truth there were have been completely lost to us.

    • Paul Jenkins So you're an "almost-mythicist"?

    • Helen Marple-Horvat Lord save me from the stupid! :P

    • Helen Marple-Horvat Its like the mention of even just the name of Jesus and everyone does a

      How high can we pee into the sky contest!! x :)

    • Helen Marple-Horvat with...seriously

    • Paul Baird Thanks for sharing Helen Marple-Horvat. I did ask a simple question.

    • Helen Marple-Horvat There was a question? I thought the thread went into BS land ?

    • Paul Baird and that is why the nice kids don't like playing with you.
      Monday at 22:14 · · 1

    • Paul Jenkins Myth assist:
      Religious satire from holy roomies Jesus & Mohammed in a twice weekly comic strip.
      about an hour ago · ·