Why bother with theologians? - steve's posterous
No more William Lane Craig for me. His debates with Krauss and Harris clearly showed his arguments to be moribund. Time to move on.
Harris is right, I was wrong | The Uncredible Hallq
More from Chris Hallquist on Craig vs Harris.
Debating God: Atheist and Evangelical Face Off at Notre Dame | (A)theologies | Religion Dispatches
An inside view of Craig vs Harris.
Sam the Man
Bruce Hood meets the man of the week.
Metamagician and the Hellfire Club: How I see the "New Atheism" - Part 1 of 2
Russell Blackford is always insightful — even though I don't always agree with him.
Religion lies about women - On Faith - The Washington Post
Paula Kirby on yet more lies of religion.
Sunday, 17 April 2011
Saturday, 16 April 2011
Could I believe in a supernatural God?
Something that came up in the latest Skepticule Extra discussion (podcast due out imminently — watch this space) prompts me to clarify a change of position. Back in January of 2010 I blogged about what I thought it would take for me to become a believer in God. That post appears somewhat inconclusive now, as I seem to have moved to a more hard-line stance.
Listening to a recent exchange between Richard Dawkins and A. C. Grayling, and reading Grayling's subsequent email to-and-fro with Jerry Coyne, I've realised that there's probably nothing that would convince me of the existence of God.
This of course stems from my naturalistic worldview, in which supernatural entities or events are precluded by definition. However:
The Bard may have been suggesting that there are things we know nothing of, but the more we find out, the more we realise that the universe is strange. And though strange, it has never, not even once, been found to be supernatural. Every time a "mystery" has been explained by science, that explanation has been a natural one. Not once has science come up with an explanation involving supernatural forces. Some might object that the remit of science prevents this, but what else are we to go on? Divine revelation?
Before I'm accused of being closed-minded on this issue, I should first point out that I consider the problem to be essentially one of definition. If you ask me what it would take for me to be convinced of the existence of God, I will necessarily want a clear definition of that God. You tell me precisely and coherently what you mean by God — with no obfuscation or appeals to mystery or ineffability — and I will tell you precisely and coherently what it would take for me to believe in that God.
Listening to a recent exchange between Richard Dawkins and A. C. Grayling, and reading Grayling's subsequent email to-and-fro with Jerry Coyne, I've realised that there's probably nothing that would convince me of the existence of God.
This of course stems from my naturalistic worldview, in which supernatural entities or events are precluded by definition. However:
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
William Shakespeare: Hamlet, Act 1, Scene 5
The Bard may have been suggesting that there are things we know nothing of, but the more we find out, the more we realise that the universe is strange. And though strange, it has never, not even once, been found to be supernatural. Every time a "mystery" has been explained by science, that explanation has been a natural one. Not once has science come up with an explanation involving supernatural forces. Some might object that the remit of science prevents this, but what else are we to go on? Divine revelation?
Before I'm accused of being closed-minded on this issue, I should first point out that I consider the problem to be essentially one of definition. If you ask me what it would take for me to be convinced of the existence of God, I will necessarily want a clear definition of that God. You tell me precisely and coherently what you mean by God — with no obfuscation or appeals to mystery or ineffability — and I will tell you precisely and coherently what it would take for me to believe in that God.
Labels:
A. C. Grayling,
belief,
God,
Hamlet,
Jerry Coyne,
naturalism,
Richard Dawkins,
supernature,
William Shakespeare
Friday, 15 April 2011
Half an hour with the man of the week: Sam Harris on the Pod Delusion
A bit of a coup for the Pod Delusion, snagging what appears to be an exclusive interview with Sam Harris. Full marks to James O'Malley and Liz Lutgendorff for their insightful questions to the man of the week:
Direct link to mp3:
http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/PodDelusionExtra/~5/e-5lvw8K4EY/73131_20110415011202.mp3
Edited highlights of this interview are included in this week's regular Pod Delusion episode:
http://poddelusion.co.uk/blog/2011/04/15/episode-80-15th-april-2011/
Direct link to mp3:
http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/ThePodDelusion/~5/lzcbhEY7GgQ/73128_20110415010548.mp3
The audio from Sam Harris's conversation with Richard Dawkins is also available:
http://poddelusion.co.uk/blog/2011/04/13/sam-harris-richard-dawkins-talk-about-the-moral-landscape/
Direct link to mp3:
http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/PodDelusionExtra/~5/sKNwf1rmyI4/72635_20110413141016.mp3
Enjoy!
Direct link to mp3:
http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/PodDelusionExtra/~5/e-5lvw8K4EY/73131_20110415011202.mp3
Edited highlights of this interview are included in this week's regular Pod Delusion episode:
http://poddelusion.co.uk/blog/2011/04/15/episode-80-15th-april-2011/
Direct link to mp3:
http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/ThePodDelusion/~5/lzcbhEY7GgQ/73128_20110415010548.mp3
The audio from Sam Harris's conversation with Richard Dawkins is also available:
http://poddelusion.co.uk/blog/2011/04/13/sam-harris-richard-dawkins-talk-about-the-moral-landscape/
Direct link to mp3:
http://feedproxy.google.com/~r/PodDelusionExtra/~5/sKNwf1rmyI4/72635_20110413141016.mp3
Enjoy!
Labels:
James O'Malley,
Liz Lutgendorff,
Pod Delusion,
Sam Harris
Thursday, 14 April 2011
Burnee links for Thursday
Sam Harris vs. William Lane Craig debate review (part 1)
Luke Muehlhauser's review.
The Sam Harris-William Lane Craig debate: a review | The Uncredible Hallq
Chris Hallquist's review.
American Atheists | Interview: Douglas Adams
An interview about atheism.
(Via The Atheist Experience.)
FT.com / Books / Non-Fiction - The Ego Trick
A. C. Grayling reviews Julian Baggini's new book.
Giles Fraser on "The Moral Landscape" - steve's posterous
Steve Zara reviews the review.
The mythical Sam Harris | Andrew Brown | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk
Andrew Brown was apparently at the Harris/Fraser event, but I wonder if he's read The Moral Landscape? If he has, maybe he didn't get it.
Harris v Craig : Pharyngula
Looks like P. Z. Myers has undergone a conversion. Of sorts.
Shades of gray : Pharyngula
A bit of catching up and I came across this. Hey PZ, when's your book due out?!
Luke Muehlhauser's review.
The Sam Harris-William Lane Craig debate: a review | The Uncredible Hallq
Chris Hallquist's review.
American Atheists | Interview: Douglas Adams
An interview about atheism.
(Via The Atheist Experience.)
FT.com / Books / Non-Fiction - The Ego Trick
A. C. Grayling reviews Julian Baggini's new book.
Giles Fraser on "The Moral Landscape" - steve's posterous
Steve Zara reviews the review.
The mythical Sam Harris | Andrew Brown | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk
Andrew Brown was apparently at the Harris/Fraser event, but I wonder if he's read The Moral Landscape? If he has, maybe he didn't get it.
Harris v Craig : Pharyngula
Looks like P. Z. Myers has undergone a conversion. Of sorts.
Shades of gray : Pharyngula
A bit of catching up and I came across this. Hey PZ, when's your book due out?!
Labels:
Burnee links
Wednesday, 13 April 2011
Debate: Is there evidence for God? William Lane Craig vs Lawrence Krauss
Another day, another debate. This one is William Lane Craig vs Lawrence Krauss, arguing the toss over "Is there evidence for God?" The topic, alas, is poorly framed. What kind of evidence? If we're talking about pretty poor evidence, then Craig has it sewn up. Indeed this was exactly the tack he took, though needlessly (and somewhat comically) dressing it up with a ridiculous equation. In effect he said, "I have some evidence. Not very good evidence, but evidence. Therefore I win."
As in his debate a few days later with Sam Harris, he succeeded in frustrating those who might have wanted him to get to grips with the important issues. Lawrence Krauss is one of the foremost scientists in the world today, and he has much interesting insight into the nature of the cosmos, and — because he's thought about these things — whether the cosmos has a god in it. But Craig simply repeated his painfully circular syllogisms ad nauseam, and the whole thing seemed like a waste of time.
Krauss, it appears, thought so too. In a substantial guest-post on P. Z. Myers' blog Pharyngula he explains why:
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/04/05/lawrence-krauss-vs-william-lan/
But perhaps before reading Krauss's post mortem report you should watch the debate itself (but be warned — the audio on these videos is dreadful):
Part 1 of 6 http://youtu.be/71ZhJL56bdQ
Part 2 of 6 http://youtu.be/jHHTYbusTmw
Part 3 of 6 http://youtu.be/Tutz5id90lk
Part 4 of 6 http://youtu.be/vpv5mMRFUgQ
Part 5 of 6 http://youtu.be/WVOCxP8aWIY
Part 6 of 6 http://youtu.be/Fs_pgaSrxP8
P. Z. Myers also has some things to say about the debate, this amongst them:
Watching William Lane Craig used to be interesting, but I've seen him do the same stuff over and over, and now he's just boring.
As in his debate a few days later with Sam Harris, he succeeded in frustrating those who might have wanted him to get to grips with the important issues. Lawrence Krauss is one of the foremost scientists in the world today, and he has much interesting insight into the nature of the cosmos, and — because he's thought about these things — whether the cosmos has a god in it. But Craig simply repeated his painfully circular syllogisms ad nauseam, and the whole thing seemed like a waste of time.
Krauss, it appears, thought so too. In a substantial guest-post on P. Z. Myers' blog Pharyngula he explains why:
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2011/04/05/lawrence-krauss-vs-william-lan/
But perhaps before reading Krauss's post mortem report you should watch the debate itself (but be warned — the audio on these videos is dreadful):
Part 1 of 6 http://youtu.be/71ZhJL56bdQ
Part 2 of 6 http://youtu.be/jHHTYbusTmw
Part 3 of 6 http://youtu.be/Tutz5id90lk
Part 4 of 6 http://youtu.be/vpv5mMRFUgQ
Part 5 of 6 http://youtu.be/WVOCxP8aWIY
Part 6 of 6 http://youtu.be/Fs_pgaSrxP8
P. Z. Myers also has some things to say about the debate, this amongst them:
Also, Craig claims to be using Bayesian logic. No, he is not. Scribbling a few trivial equations on his slides does not substitute for Craig's painful ignorance of physics.
Labels:
evidence,
Lawrence Krauss,
P. Z. Myers,
Pharyngula,
Sam Harris,
William Lane Craig
Tuesday, 12 April 2011
Templeton's not-so-hidden agenda
What does the Templeton Foundation think it's doing? This year's Templeton prize, worth one million pounds sterling, has been awarded to the UK's Astronomer Royal, Sir Martin Rees. Usually this is an award for saying nice things about religion. This year, it seems, it's for not saying anything particularly unpleasant about religion.
Martin Rees is not a believer in God, though he does apparently go to church. He says this is because he likes the music and the architecture, but it could also have something to do with his job; in addition to being the Queen's stargazer he's also Master of Trinity College, Cambridge — a post I imagine requires some measure of ceremonial officiation.
I first learned of this year's award from Ian Sample's article at the Guardian, which has a link to the transcript of an interview he conducted with his subject. The transcript is revealing — inasmuch as Rees is careful to reveal as little as possible (though after Sample's opening gambit I'm not surprised his interviewee appears reticent).
So, if someone offers you a prize, no strings attached, for something more or less unspecified that you may or may not have done, should you accept? If it's a bottle of Scotch you might feel a tinge of guilt if you're not quite sure what it is you're supposed to have done to deserve it. But what if the prize is a million quid? That, I think, would require some serious soul-searching. What would concern me most is the acknowledged mission of the organisation awarding the prize, which is for "affirming life's spiritual dimension". Knowing that mission I would feel constrained in my subsequent actions and words. This is likely Templeton's intention. By spreading their money around they are casting a financial net over a number of economically vulnerable voices, ensuring their own agenda is publicised. You only have to look at how much publicity this year's award has already garnered, to see how effective a strategy that is. (And yes, I know I'm contributing to it, if only to a minuscule degree, but the alternative is to ignore the issue and let Templeton have the arena to themselves.)
Lewis Wolpert and Peter Atkins discussed the prize on the Today Programme last Thursday morning. They both consider it to be an insidious distortion of scientific motivation, but I was surprised to hear Atkins say that if offered the prize he would accept it. (This eventuality is, however, even less likely than the prize being awarded to Richard Dawkins, who has in the past referred to Rees as a "compliant Quisling" for allowing the Royal Society to host a Templeton event.) Atkins went on to say he would use the money to set up an organisation to oppose Templeton and promote the separation of religion and science.
Jerry Coyne responded to the award in no uncertain terms — again at the Guardian — only to be followed by Mark Vernon once more cheer-leading for Templeton a day or so later. (This is hardly surprising — Vernon admits to being in receipt of Templeton benefaction.)
This whole affair reminds me of the Writers of the Future Contest, intended to encourage serious young genre authors to enter a fiction-writing competition for generous prizes. These prizes used to include print publication and participation in a residential writing workshop. Year on year this award has nurtured some of genre writing's brightest young talent, and is held to be a Good Thing. Only one problem: the Writers of the Future Contest is funded by Scientology. There's no coercion, no indoctrination, no personality or E-meter tests, and as far as I'm aware Scientology is never even mentioned unless it comes up in connection with the contest's deceased founder, science fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard.
But, tainted money is tainted money. And scruples are scruples — some people have them and some people don't.
Sir Martin Rees |
I first learned of this year's award from Ian Sample's article at the Guardian, which has a link to the transcript of an interview he conducted with his subject. The transcript is revealing — inasmuch as Rees is careful to reveal as little as possible (though after Sample's opening gambit I'm not surprised his interviewee appears reticent).
So, if someone offers you a prize, no strings attached, for something more or less unspecified that you may or may not have done, should you accept? If it's a bottle of Scotch you might feel a tinge of guilt if you're not quite sure what it is you're supposed to have done to deserve it. But what if the prize is a million quid? That, I think, would require some serious soul-searching. What would concern me most is the acknowledged mission of the organisation awarding the prize, which is for "affirming life's spiritual dimension". Knowing that mission I would feel constrained in my subsequent actions and words. This is likely Templeton's intention. By spreading their money around they are casting a financial net over a number of economically vulnerable voices, ensuring their own agenda is publicised. You only have to look at how much publicity this year's award has already garnered, to see how effective a strategy that is. (And yes, I know I'm contributing to it, if only to a minuscule degree, but the alternative is to ignore the issue and let Templeton have the arena to themselves.)
Lewis Wolpert and Peter Atkins discussed the prize on the Today Programme last Thursday morning. They both consider it to be an insidious distortion of scientific motivation, but I was surprised to hear Atkins say that if offered the prize he would accept it. (This eventuality is, however, even less likely than the prize being awarded to Richard Dawkins, who has in the past referred to Rees as a "compliant Quisling" for allowing the Royal Society to host a Templeton event.) Atkins went on to say he would use the money to set up an organisation to oppose Templeton and promote the separation of religion and science.
Jerry Coyne responded to the award in no uncertain terms — again at the Guardian — only to be followed by Mark Vernon once more cheer-leading for Templeton a day or so later. (This is hardly surprising — Vernon admits to being in receipt of Templeton benefaction.)
This whole affair reminds me of the Writers of the Future Contest, intended to encourage serious young genre authors to enter a fiction-writing competition for generous prizes. These prizes used to include print publication and participation in a residential writing workshop. Year on year this award has nurtured some of genre writing's brightest young talent, and is held to be a Good Thing. Only one problem: the Writers of the Future Contest is funded by Scientology. There's no coercion, no indoctrination, no personality or E-meter tests, and as far as I'm aware Scientology is never even mentioned unless it comes up in connection with the contest's deceased founder, science fiction writer L. Ron Hubbard.
But, tainted money is tainted money. And scruples are scruples — some people have them and some people don't.
Monday, 11 April 2011
Giles Fraser lays aside his woolly mantle to review Sam Harris
Tonight Sam Harris is discussing morality with Giles Fraser. As I previously blogged, this is the event nearest to me, out of Sam Harris's three announced appearances on his UK book tour. Nevertheless I decided not to get a ticket because so far I've been severely underwhelmed by Giles Fraser (his recent spot on the Today Programme with A. C. Grayling is an example).
Earlier today, however, I discovered that last Saturday Guardian Online published Giles Fraser's review of The Moral Landscape, and reading it I found myself wishing I had swallowed my misgivings and arranged to attend the discussion. (The fact that IQ2 decided not to live-stream the event after all, is but one more regret.)
So what is it about Fraser's review that has brought on my change of heart? Mostly it's because he seems to have cast off the woolly mantle that has to date muffled anything of his I've come across. He reviews The Moral Landscape in a forthright manner, with hardly any wishy-washy equivocation. I still think he's wrong in most of what he says about the book, but his review convinces me that his discussion with its author would be more interesting than I had thought.
Fraser takes some potshots at Harris, but I think they misfire. For instance, on David Hume's point that you can't derive values from facts:
Fraser also commits — on a grand scale — what might be called the "not my religion" fallacy:
He goes on to imply that he's heard it all before:
I also think Fraser has missed one of Harris's key points:
It seems to me that Harris does indeed address this — it's what I understand by there being different peaks in the moral landscape. Fraser legitimately raises the necessity of some kind of metric for determining how high up the peaks or deep in the valleys moral actions are, as have other critics, but Harris isn't saying he's got all the answers. He's asking for science to be brought to bear on moral questions. Fraser, however, won't have it:
Here we see Fraser's woolly equivocation breaking through once more. It sounds to me like a plea not just for pluralistic society but for pluralistic belief. Such is, after all, the Anglican way.
UPDATE 2011-04-13:
The mp3 audio of the Fraser/Harris discussion can be downloaded here:
http://iq2.podbean.com/mf/feed/bhegmw/sam-harris-IQ2.mp3
Earlier today, however, I discovered that last Saturday Guardian Online published Giles Fraser's review of The Moral Landscape, and reading it I found myself wishing I had swallowed my misgivings and arranged to attend the discussion. (The fact that IQ2 decided not to live-stream the event after all, is but one more regret.)
So what is it about Fraser's review that has brought on my change of heart? Mostly it's because he seems to have cast off the woolly mantle that has to date muffled anything of his I've come across. He reviews The Moral Landscape in a forthright manner, with hardly any wishy-washy equivocation. I still think he's wrong in most of what he says about the book, but his review convinces me that his discussion with its author would be more interesting than I had thought.
Fraser takes some potshots at Harris, but I think they misfire. For instance, on David Hume's point that you can't derive values from facts:
But Harris will have none of it. Science has sold itself cheap. The peace treaty must be torn up. Science can indeed tell us about morality. Indeed, science can determine morality.
With regard to the god Harris describes, I am a much more convinced atheist than he – even though I am a priest. For Harris asks constantly for evidence, with the implication that if he discovered some, he would change his mind. My own line would be that even if the god he described was proved to exist, I would see it as my moral duty to be an atheist.
What is presented as Harris's big new idea is really just reheated utilitarianism with wellbeing in place of pleasure.
There are so many problems with utilitarianism, it's a pity Harris does so little to address them. How can one quantify the sum total of wellbeing produced by a single action when the potential consequences of any particular action are infinite? So keen is he to turn morality into science that Harris presses on regardless. His demand is that all morality be calibrated on a single scale. Yet if one observes what it is that people call good (and isn't observation a scientific golden rule?), instead of assuming what good ought to look like, one surely recognises very different sorts of moral value.
Harris sees the great moral battle of our day as one between belief and unbelief. I see it as between those who insist that the world be captured by a single philosophy and those who don't.
UPDATE 2011-04-13:
The mp3 audio of the Fraser/Harris discussion can be downloaded here:
http://iq2.podbean.com/mf/feed/bhegmw/sam-harris-IQ2.mp3
Labels:
Giles Fraser,
Guardian,
morality,
Sam Harris
Subscribe to:
Posts (Atom)