Showing posts with label Justin Brierley. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Justin Brierley. Show all posts

Sunday, 16 September 2012

Thought for the Day will not be opened to atheists

"Thought for the Day will not be opened to atheists, says BBC religion chief" — says the Telegraph:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/religion/9530350/Thought-for-the-Day-will-not-be-opened-to-atheists-says-BBC-religion-chief.html

Not a surprise, but some of us will keep plugging away. I object to the implication that theists are the only commentators qualified to think. The BBC should include non-religious viewpoints on Thought for the Day, or else rename it Religious Thought for the Day or something similar — something clearly indicating that these are thoughts from a religious perspective.

I was alerted to this latest non-development — and latest demonstration of BBC obstinacy — by Justin Brierley's post on the Unbelievable? Facebook page, to which I added a comment (whole thread to date follows):


Unbelievable? · 1,641 like this.
Thursday at 23:32 via Twitter ·
The BBC won't be letting atheists on Thought For The Day - but you can still come on my radio show instead http://t.co/7RudXHoA
telegraph.co.uk
The BBC will resist calls to include atheists on Thought for the Day, the corporation’s head of religion has said.
  • 7 people like this.
  • Alan Vaughan Good for them! Those with no religion have no place on a religious programme. If it were a stamp collecting programme I would expect only those who collect stamps to participate. Listeners would have no desire to listen to someone with no interest in stamps. Kudos
  • Justin Schieber We appreciate it Justin.
  • Paul Jenkins “People have complained, as they have the right to, and I have taken a view that at this moment in time as far as I’m concerned we stay as we do.

    “It is a specific slot within the
    Today programme which is a reflection from a religious perspective on stories of importance in the news.”

    Well, the slot *is* called "Religious Thought for the Day", so therefore no-one but the religious is qualified to be on it. If, however, the slot was called merely "Thought for the Day" then one could naturally expect non-religious viewpoints to be given a proportionate hearing.

    Or have I got that wrong?
  • Paul Jenkins Frankly I can't decide whether I'm disgusted or simply resigned.

    (In protest, I'm resolved to look elsewhere for my platitudes.)
  • Andrew McBrearty Booooo! for the BBC... Yay! for Justin. :)
  • Ian-Luke Penwald Where is the share link????
  • Peter Byrom We've been given plenty of rhetoric recently about how atheism is not a religion or even a worldview (e.g. "if atheism is a religion, then off is a TV channel, and abstinence is a sex position" etc) so if this really is an officially religious slot then, frankly, the atheists can't have it both ways.

    However, I must say I'm disappointed that the BBC doesn't have a programme like Justin's! Indeed there's plenty of anti-religion and pro-secularism bias in the BBC already so, again frankly, I hardly think the NSS have much to complain about and it looks much more like they're trying to encroach upon one of the few religious slots left.
  • Fergus Gallagher Atheism is not a religion, but it is a position with respect to religion.
  • Paul Jenkins If TftD is an officially religious slot, that ought to be clear from its name.
  • John Humberstone "We've been given plenty of rhetoric recently about how atheism is not a religion or even a worldview (e.g. "if atheism is a religion, then off is a TV channel, and abstinence is a sex position" etc) so if this really is an officially religious slot then, frankly, the atheists can't have it both ways."

    All that needs to happen is that they stick to the title of the slot - Thought for the Day. Couldn't be simpler really.

Saturday, 25 August 2012

Last year's Law/Craig Evil God Debate — full video

Last year I went to the debate between Stephen Law and William Lane Craig. Though the audio of the whole thing was made available for streaming and download (and still is) the day after, it's taken a while for the video version to surface. But here it is, along with a promo or "taster":

http://youtu.be/9yytiT9h8TQ


http://youtu.be/w7FhphWDokA


There's plenty of debate about the Debate too, by both participants and others — just Google "Craig/Law debate" for a profusion of links.

The three Pauls discussed the debate on Skepticule Extra 16, available here:
http://www.skepticule.co.uk/2011/11/skepextra-016-20111030.html

Wednesday, 22 August 2012

Ehrperson on Unbelievable?

Another Facebook thread repost, this one about Bart Ehrman's recent discussion with Justin Brierley on Unbelievable? regarding "Jesus mythicism".

  • So...Ehrperson on Unbelievable. Thoughts?
    · · · Monday at 00:06

    • Paul Jenkins Very easy for Ehrman to say Price is wrong when he's not there to back up his statements. I know it was only a small part of the show but Justin lets this happen too often IMHO.

      I thought Ehrman skated round Carrier's criticisms without answering them, preferring to moan about the latter's caustic reviewing style. Anyone who's heard Carrier deliver a talk will know that his style is generally mocking and snarky. Complaining that he's "unscholarly" is really evading the issues.

    • Paul Baird Didn't listen to it. My focus is more on the social impact of Christianity. Aside from the nativity I'm not terribly interested in whether or not Jesus the man existed. The nativity itself is just so wacko and borrows from so many other myths and fables that I do like asking Christians to answer questions about it - to make them think.

    • Paul Jenkins ‎"The nativity itself is just so wacko and borrows from so many other myths and fables..."

      Which was one of the points Ehrman attempts to refute.

    • Paul Baird I think once someone comes up with a source for the conversations between the Three Wise Men and Herod or The Shepherds and the Angels then I might take notice.

    • Paul Jenkins But it's in the Bible! (Oops, sorry, already done that bit....)

    • Paul Baird and what was He doing between birth, age 12 and age 30 ?

      The Long Running Ancient Levant version of Big Brother ?

    • Paul Baird ‎"It's day 5687, Mary has two nominations, Joseph six and Jesus four. Who will be voted out ? You decide !"

    • Paul Jenkins In the latest (I think) "The Human Bible" Robert Price comments on whether theologians believe the baby Jesus was divinely perfect. I remember reading some commentary about whether the teenage Jesus had "impure thoughts".

      Not exactly world-shattering.

    • Fergus Gallagher Just listening to http://strangefrequenciesradio.wordpress.com/2012/08/19/episode-204-david-fitzgerald-speaks-about-jesus-mythicism/

      "David Fitzgerald, author of “Nailed: Ten Christian Myths That Show Jesus Never Existed at All,” joined us today to talk about Jesus mythicism. If Jesus was so important and performed so many miracles during his lifetime, why was nothing written about him by those who knew him? Could it be that Jesus was just a myth? "

      (It's in the 2nd part, sep. mp3)


      strangefrequenciesradio.wordpress.com
      Episode #204 – David Fitzgerald Welcome back to Strange Frequencies Radio!  Can ...See more
      Monday at 19:01 · ·

    • Paul Baird I can believe that after reading some of Glenn Peoples guff.

      So many Phds in search of so much irrelevance.

    • Helen Marple-Horvat are you guys all mythicists? Thats crazy if true...I will have to clear off. lol

    • Paul Baird Helen Marple-Horvat - in terms of the Nativity - yes. Unless you have a source for the two conversations that I mentioned, and maybe some idea of what Jesus was up to for 30 years before he began his ministry.

      Basing his divinity on 1/11th of his life does not not appear to be sustainable.

    • Paul Jenkins Personally I think it's more likely than not a person or persons by the name of Jesus lived around that time and did things that caught people's attention. So I'm not a mythicist. However, I'm highly suspicious of the Gospel accounts, and of the fact that a large portion of the NT was written by one man with a specific agenda.

    • Fergus Gallagher I put it like this: the central relevant detail about Jesus is whether he rose from the dead ("Jesus-Christ") or not ("Jesus-not-Christ").

      I don't think Jesus-Christ existed and who really cares that much about Jesus-not-Christ?

    • Paul Jenkins Fergus, that's a fair point, but mythicists seem to be saying that Jesus-not-Christ didn't exist either. The existence of Jesus-not-Christ, however, seems to be relevant to whether Jesus-Christ existed (as far as believers are concerned).

      I'd probably go as far as saying Jesus was a legendary character, but not an out-and-out myth. I think the stories are probably based on some facts. I don't think the character of Jesus was totally made up. It's been suggested he was a composite, which seems likely to me.

    • Fergus Gallagher ‎"The existence of Jesus-not-Christ, however, seems to be relevant to whether Jesus-Christ existed (as far as believers are concerned)."

      No - they are distinct and incompatible in this formulation.

    • Fergus Gallagher The other way I like to put it is that I think a Jesus existed in a similar way to the way Robin Hood existed - whatever grains of truth there were have been completely lost to us.

    • Paul Jenkins So you're an "almost-mythicist"?

    • Helen Marple-Horvat Lord save me from the stupid! :P

    • Helen Marple-Horvat Its like the mention of even just the name of Jesus and everyone does a

      How high can we pee into the sky contest!! x :)

    • Helen Marple-Horvat right....dog...off with...seriously

    • Paul Baird Thanks for sharing Helen Marple-Horvat. I did ask a simple question.

    • Helen Marple-Horvat There was a question? I thought the thread went into BS land ?

    • Paul Baird and that is why the nice kids don't like playing with you.
      Monday at 22:14 · · 1

    • Paul Jenkins Myth assist:

      http://www.jesusandmo.net/2012/08/22/case/


      www.jesusandmo.net
      Religious satire from holy roomies Jesus & Mohammed in a twice weekly comic strip.
      about an hour ago · ·